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Has anybody heard a Naim 500 driving B&W Nautilus 801s? When I got the 801s I had a 250 - which proved to be totally inadequate at anything but very low listening levels. I then moved to a pair of 135s. Better - but still having severe problems at even moderate listening levels. I then went beserk and purchased a pair of Classe CA-M400 monoblocks. Umm.....now they do play loud.....effortlessly...and detailed....but its not satisfying. They seem bass-light and high frequencies too harsh. I'm not happy with them so what do you think of going for a 500 ?
Other equipment is CDS, Sondek/Ekos/Klyde/Lingo/Linto into NAC 52. Any comments/advice appreciated.... It does seem that the 801s are the hardest speakers on earth to drive.....but they can sound lovely - to my ears at least.... |
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Administrator |
Buy what you heard making them sound lovely. |
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They sounded best with the 250......but only at very low listening levels and whilst I'm not a volume junkie I like more than the 250 could deliver.
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New Member |
simple, change the speakers
no point going round the houses, get something that works well with the 250 or the 135's I heard a chap say i like my speakers, but they need more bass, what about a sub, I say well then you don't like your speakers, change them for ones you like that also do bass, another friend loves his amp, but can't get speakers to work with them, how does he know he likes his amp? he's never got it to gel with speakers to his satisfaction. Don't go chasing your tail, there are many other speakers out ther that will work well with a 250 and sound great at high, middle and low volumes, to compromise so much for one piece of the jigsaw means what you have isn't really what you want, even if you think it is Gte to your dealer and dem some speakers. |
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From my experience, the 500 will sound much much better than the 250/135s. It's in a different league completely.
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hi, why did you buy 801 in the first place when it's almost impossible to get them sound good? there's alot of other speakers out there sounding good with a 250; neats, monitor audio platinium, kudos, kef and zu amongst others..  |
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Senior Member |
Fossil.
A 801 is an expensive speakers to *save*. Good luck with it. |
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Senior Member |
I had 802D's which have the same sensitivity and impedance characteristics as the 801's on home demo for about a month running on my 552/500 system. They have prodigious bass capability which I gather is even more apparent with the 'washing machine', as some refer to the 801.
The 500 drove the 802D's with excellent control and I have no doubt it could do the same with the 801's. There was no flabbiness in the bass presentation which was really extended. The problem for me was that the bass output was too big for my relative modest room size (3.5 x 5.4 meters). The effect was to overwhelm the mid and high performance which was frustrating because it had a beautifull tone somewhat buried behind the bass. This is the main consideration for you I think. You will get full on performance with a 500 so it will be about how your room deals with the bass, which often gets mentioned as the challenge with 801's in reviews. The 800's and their smaller brother the 802's are considered more domestically friendly with their dual bass drivers which are individually quite a bit smaller than the big one in the 801's but even they are more for large listening spaces and certianly not to my taste, especially at the price they cost. regards Geoff |
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Senior Member |
Is it just me or do some folk have more money than sense? Or is this a piss-take?
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Senior Member |
Try Bryston amplification. |
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Geoff, Thanks for the input. Sadly the 801s are MUCH harder to drive than the original 802s - and the 802Ds are supposed to be even easier to drive. A close friend had 802s with a NAP250 and that drove them with little problem - but its totally overwhelmed by the 801s. The sensitivity and impedence may be close to the 802Ds but believe me they are VERY different beasts to drive. I think the inductance loading is HUGE from the 15" washing-machine magnet and this introduces a very oddly phased, current-hungry load on the amplifier. Excess bass is possibly a problem - although with the Classe monoblocks I think they are a tad bass-light. All in all I think I'm going to have to audition a 500 in the near future - I just wondered if anybody had already done so.... To all those suggesting different speakers thanks for your thoughts. However, I have never heard anything come close to the 801s in all-round performance. The 802s were close - sort of like a lean 801 - and the 802Ds sounded very nice especially in the treble - but both were missing something from the 801s. Sorry guys - but ditching the 801s will really be the last, least preferred option as far as I am concerned. |
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Member |
HAD more money than sense I think is a tad closer.... |
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Senior Member |
Fossil
As you are London based could I suggest that you pop into Graham's near Islington and have a chat - they are heavily into both Naim and B+W and should be able to help. I recall their advice regarding the 802D's being that their recommended minimum to drive them was a 300 so it would be interesting to hear what they say, and presumably could demonstrate for you, about the 801's. Peter |
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New Member |
Have you tried other brands? this shouldn't be difficult, i'd love to know how ou guys who determine that sos and so component is the best, yet you have never heard them work right? oh except for low volume, did you perhaps consider that maybe you'll never get them to work right at higher volume? Still it's your money, if you wanna waste it Over and out. |
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Member |
Peter, All my kit, apart from the Classes, has come from Grahams. I acquired the 801s, ex-dem at a huge discount, from Grahams and they have consistently, unwaveringly recommended a 500 to drive them. At the time I couldn't afford a 500 (I really still can't) and I got the Classes at a reasonable cost. I veered away from Naim for the power amps partly because I read in several forums that you really needed to bi-amp 500s with 801s because of their power-hungry nature. I think what I failed to realise is how loud the 801s will play - far far louder than could be considered reasonable in a small-ish room. I'm now hoping that the 500 will drive them to the levels I like to listen at - even if it runs out of puff when I turn the wick up.... I'm arranging a home-audition of the 500 so I'm going to find out.... |
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Senior Member |
Its not our business, but you raised the matter... If you cant afford a 500, dont buy it. Its not worth the worry and financial heartache. Especially as we are looking into a possible recession and higher unemployment and inflation. |
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New Member |
Good call, thing is no one but you knows what you favour, it doesn't matter a jot if we think the combo is bad, or the best thing since sliced bread, or if Grahams reccomend the 500. Remember though, that if the 500 fails to drive them to your satisfaction it won't be you or the 500 at fault, all it will mean is you prefer some other combo, if thats the case consider a different brand of speakers. Getting huge discount is fine if you really want the product, but sometimes we are lulled into thinking that this is more expensive, it must be better. Perhaps another speaker that might be cheaper will give you all you're after, or may work better with the 500. Of course the 500 might be all you need, have fun finding out. we sometimes go down blind alleys in our search for muiscal nirvana, it's often best to see what else is availabel for our budget, and audition that too. Just because i say something is better, doesn't mean you'll agree, and you won't be wrong or misinformed, you'll just have a different taste. Of course the 500 may well give you all you want from the combo have fun finding out. |
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Member |
When I first heard the 801s I loved them - they sounded perfect to my ears, at both low and high volume. That was a long time ago and the dealer can't remember what kit was driving them at the time I heard them. I never thought to ask because, at the time, the price of the 801s put them firmly in the "un-realistic dream system" territory. Of course I've listened to other speakers, other brands, some at equally stratospheric prices, but none have brought quite such a broad smile to my face.... |
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New Member |
Things we heard a long time ago and stick in our minds are dangerous. When we heard these things long ago our references where different, we may have had an entry system with cheapo speakers at the time, so the improvements we heard then where massive. Since then you have moved up the foodchain, your references have changes, perhaps now you are listening more critically than you where a long time back, your will not accept faults that you were unaware if back then. A bit like in my youth I lusted after a Lotus Elan MKI it was quick and fun, now a well driven hot hatch would see it off. Also perhaps the 801's may not be working in your current room. Anyway have some fun auditioning, and make sure you stay in the driving seat. Please let us know how you get on. Your's Devil's Advocate  |
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Member |
I share your love of the 801, at least in looks when dressed in black. Good luck with the audition, hope it works for you.
I drive my modest B&Ws (804S)with Conrad Johnson - Naim just does the front end. Unfortunately CJ have a crazy price in the UK compared to Australia so I could not recommend it as an option, and you would be looking at a 350 rather than a CA200 like mine for best results. |
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