"I would also say around half of the hi-fi systems I have heard are not giving over 50% of their potential due to set up issues, and I'm talking about the cheap and free stuff here like not using naff plug boards, poor speaker position etc. This is before you even get to the stands!"

Now, comments like that are bound to induce paranoia, especially amongst those of us still in our Naim apprenticeship, so would those with great experience of these things care to share their knowledge of any other things to look for? In particular those things that don't cost.

Have just gone from a Nait3 to 82/140 and I am more than satisfied with the improvement, but would hate to think that it wasn't doing everything it could.

JonM

PS Thought that rather than this getting lost in a long topic, I'd start a new one.

AS you guess setup does have an important part to play. Usually people can't imagine the difference a small tweak will make but it really is worth spending a little time. The obvious place to start is Stands. It can't be stressed enough. Get some decent ones. They cost but are probably as important as the boxes sitting on them. If you can't afford that you should try Vuk's nut/ball/mdf idea. This works well and is very cheap.

Next positioning. This will depend on how much of a compromise your listening room is. Try the speakers in various positions until you are happy. Obvious, maybe, but proximity chimney breasts, corners, radiators and furniture all alter the sound. Think about how the sound reflects as well. If neccesary hang up soft furnishings. Keep the delicate electronics (preamps, cd, tuner etc) away from power supplies, power amps and power sockets, anything that gives out a large magnetic field.

Keep things tidy. Check that the cables don't interfere with each other. And keep them loose. Do not nail them to the wall or floor.

But above all relax and listen to the music.

Tom

quote:

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There was a very interesting comment recently from Tony Lonorgon:

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That’s a first… I said…

"I would also say around half of the hi-fi systems I have heard are not giving over 50% of their potential due to set up issues, and I'm talking about the cheap and free stuff here like not using naff plug boards, poor speaker position etc. This is before you even get to the stands!"

My main feeling after listening to many systems is that some people are far too content to sit back and expect the dealer to reach an "optimal" set up within about an hour of walking through the door with cold gear. Whilst a dealer can within tight time constraints provide a starting point, I am far to tight to consider it the final answer, I am prepared to fiddle around until I get a sound that I personally am completely happy with. I am not prepared to take someone else's opinion that the equipment is performing at its best. The more I have played around, the simpler my set up techniques have actually become.

I have stuck some basic hints up on my website - www.pfmedia.demon.co.uk/flatearth in the system set up section - its all pretty much common sense, the key is lots of patience, and the ability to admit that you don't like the sound yet. If it means spending a week moving the speakers an inch at a time, then that is what it costs…

Here is the setup hints from the site, to save hassle visiting it…

• Supports. Assume that supports make a big difference. There are many out there, choose wisely with your ears, not others opinion. I personally have taken the Mana route, though others I know get good results with Hutter, Quadraspire etc. Take great care setting up stands, spikes are spikes not nails – they should rest on the floorboards and not be stamped in. If necessary cut a small ‘X’ in the carpet so the spike can penetrate without force. One tip that has saved much hassle in the past is to use packing tape temporarily stuck to the carpet so you can see where the spikes land prior to cutting your ‘X’.

• Mains. Mains makes an enormous difference to the performance of a system, and just about everyone is out to sell you a solution. What is really needed is a separate spur for the hi-fi, to get it off the same ring that the cooker, fridge, water heater, etc are all adding their own noise to. Mains leads also make a big difference too. The leads that come with Naim products are thankfully really good. Avoid distribution blocks like the plague. There is a great little 4 way mains plug available from Maplin which I use. It is reviewed on www.tnt-audio.com in their tweaks section..

• Interconnects / speaker leads. For non Naim kit play away. With Naim stuff they honestly seem to know what they are doing, I have never found anything that will touch the supplied interconnects or A5 (and I take no ones word, I fiddle!). The interconnect to beat in my book is Naim Aro, the better Naim dealers sell this off the reel, and it is real cheap. Aro has blown every interconnect I have heard out of the water, and that includes some weighing in at several hundred quid plus.

Get fiddling...

Tony.

Therefore whilst I pay off the finance for these two bits I'll give serious consideration to a better pair of stands, currently using a couple of 5 shelf Target er5 tables.

Tim

Some thoughts:

'Separating Cables' proved easier said than done - how do you guys with active systems cope?

Came to the conclusion that I lack the requisite patience for optimising speaker position. Moved them around a litte at a time, but ended up getting 'distracted' by the music instead, so things can't be that bad.

One thing I've noticed in the past is that everything grooves the most when I'm standing behind the sofa, rather than sitting on it, leading me to conclude that the room is probably the biggest brake on absolute sound quality. Tried placing cusshions on the floor (bare varnished floorboards), and pinning others to the walls at first reflection points. Made far more difference, as far as AI could tell, than anything else, rendering things a bit less shouty and letting me play a little bit more loudly. Impractical as a permanent soulution, so finding an acceptable solution to room taming has become something to look at in the long term. Rugs will be brought out of storage as Autumn gathers pace so maybe this will help.

Mnay thanks again for the pointers.

JonM