A scan through the search arhives about the NBL'sleads me to wonder how things get labelled,and indeed become regarded as great.comments about the NBL's run about a ratio of 4 negatives to one positive comment.Can all these observers be right ?Is it really a speaker that fails to cut the mustard?When does the moment come when a speaker becomes one of the greats(ie isobariks) or is doomed to contant critique(the kabers)The NBL's seem to be lurching towards the latter.Can a speaker 4 years in the making and presumably well researched in terms of its positioning be so unapealing that it has poeple escaping from the listening room at hi-fi shows.the two reviews I have seen of the NBL's whilst ultimately giving the speakers the thumbs up still managed to find lots to criique.Are there any bariks owners out there who have traded them for the NBL's;I would love to hear your comparison.As someone who is thinking of upgrading to NBL'sI would be interseted to hear more about its merits as at the moment the press I have read is leaving a gremlin in my head that says approach with caution.....

Robin Williams in a mock conversation to a stoned GI asks if there is a drug problem in the ranks. to which the reply is - there's no drug problem - since everybody's got `em.

So yes, perception is 100% relative, and is also true for that moment in time.

So if NBLs are true for you, then that's all that matters.

Not what others say. I swear by SBLs, BUT the NBLs were the first Naim speaker I ever heard that sounded very good in Passive mode. And if that isnt a reflection of some innate potential, I dont know what is

Rog

I think Vik is spot on - though I prefer the quite "In more dire need of a blowjob than any man in history" from said film.

I recently heard some NBL's on the end of a CDSII/52/500 system (erm - October I think) and was very impressed - although the demo room the system was in was a bit lively and made the sound quite sharp - so conditions were not perfect and some allowances had to be made. I liked them.

I think the main problem is (perhaps as has been suggested unfairly of the new '5' slimline gear) it is a different sound / style to the SBL (I have not yet heard DBL's) and it could be thought to be an attempt by Naim to provide a more MOR 'speaker than previous models. They certainly look a site more appealing than SBL, DBL et al - not that this impresses me much- I do not really have enough expereince of Naim 'speakers to really give a judgement on relative peformance - but I would expect the 'PRaT at all costs, hey I listen mostly in mono' crowd find that their is a compromise in the NBL's.

I guess we'll see...

Jonathan

Rog,

I have heard NBLs three times.

I first heard a pre-production pair at the Naim factory on 6x135s. Although there were some faults still to be ironed out (bass rather overblown and a little shouty) it was doing things that I'd never heard from a Naim speaker. Indeed, there was a clarity, openness and unforced presentation that I'd never heard from any Naim system before.

At the Novotel show last year (1999) they were running active with prototype NAP500's which had only finished build the day before the show. VERY impressive, but again there was something that wasn't quite right. Neither overblown nor shouty - now it was clear, powerful and dynamic, but somehow sterile. Was it the not-run-in amps, or the room? That room obviously has some less-than-ideal acoustics (also apparent on the DBLs this year). Whatever, this showed a different set of strengths.

A month ago I briefly heard another pair (after only two hours of run-in) at my dealer on CDS-II/52/1x250. Wow. Far more than just a grown up SBL. One of those times where you immediately realise that something is just right. There was an ease, freedom and projection that was surprising on only a 250. They seemed to have the weight of an Isobarik, but with much more precision in the mid and top. (Perhaps this is because they don’t have the multiple mid & treble units of the Briks). The dealer reckoned that with a NAP500 they made the best system he’d ever heard!

I do wonder, however, if they have a somewhat different tonal balance to the SBL & DBL? Perhaps a fuller sound? That last demo was in a room which I consider to have bass problems, so take this comment with a large pinch of salt.

The two SBL systems which I’ve heard working really well have a tremendous seamlessness from top to bottom, but this only seems to come at the expense of scale. Although I find them really impressive, it’s more a cerebral than emotional response. Listen to that interplay. Wow, great speed. Somehow Isobariks (at their very best) can fill the room and envelop you in sound, and NBLs probably also have the volume potential, projection and richness to be able to pull it off.

Although I've heard DBLs a couple of times, I still feel I'm where I was two years ago with SBLs, not having heard them really sound quite right. What I have heard (e.g. Novotel this year) sounds comparable to not-quite-working SBLs so I’m sure the potential is there.

I firmly believe that the NBL deserves it’s place in the line-up. I'm pretty sure I'd be happy to replace my Briks with them if I could afford it.

Cheers, Martin

Martin,your post provides a good insight into things to think about,and raises for me the issue of what ones criteria is from a speaker.(The ability to fill a room being a prime one)I think it is also interesting to note that you heard the NBL's through a 250 and was impressed especially as most comments on the site I have read say 135'sare the minimum,with many saying only a 500 will do.My system comprises 52/supercap/135's so I guess I could get somewhere near that ideal.Your post raises another intersting question:with bariks being available at bargain prices these days it leaves the prospect of spending,say £900 instaead of nearly £7000 and using the "spare" dosh for other causes(like the new cartridge,the pre-fix....the shopping list of audiophile re-releases etc....

NBLs are my number 1 favourite 'speaker on the market today.

They are definitely THE speaker for those who, like me, missed out on the Isobariks.

Under correct operating conditions, NBLs give scale, intimacy, communication, PRaT and separability of phrasing.

At the moment, my only experiences of Naim 'speakers are through various Hi-Fi shows. Many of the NBL impressions from this forum and other bulletin boards have originated from Hi-Fi show demos, several from dealer demos, and a few are from lucky owners.

What I have realised is that opinions on the NBLs (and other Naim 'speakers) are mainly moulded by the operating conditions:

1) During the 1998 London Hi-Fi Show, the vast majority of the comments on the NBLs were very positive
2) During the 1999 London Hi-Fi Show, the vast majority of the comments on the NBLs were even more positive (boosted by the active 500s).
3) During the 2000 Chester Hi-Fi Show most people knew how good the NBLs are and realised how rubbish the room was.

The other difference with 3 was that the NBLs were passive. So, what went wrong with the set-up in 3? Well, the sound was glassy and shut-in and was likely to be caused by:

1) The room acoustics
2) The mains supply
3) The passive crossover - I'll give Naim the benefit of the doubt on this one.

I doubt it was the mains supply either, because the 5 series next door with Credos was fantastic - much better than the vastly more expensive set-up on its bad day. This is interesting in itself... I've never previously liked the Credos, finding them weedy and congested - and here they were rocking like crazy.

Similarly with the SBLs, fantastic on a couple of occasions and not so good on others. All of them experienced at shows.

With the DBLs, I've heard them on 3 occasions and I'm still waiting to hear them "on-song"

So, what can I conclude? [Yes, you've guessed already]. Hi-Fi shows do not consistently guarantee a preferred level performance from a Naim system. To base an opinion from the comments of others at Hi-Fi shows is wrong.

The NBL gives you the chance to have a loudspeaker that just betters the Isobarik, providing your room is up to it.

My advice - demo at home.

Andrew

P.S. I'll start a new thread with this one

Andrew Randle
2B || !2B;
4 ^ = ?;

Rog, this is an interesting thread. I heard the NBLs with the dealer using 82/Scap/180!? even so thought they sounded better than Briks on 82/Hicap/250. More transparent and more space around the music, cant say if this was due to the Scap or the NBLs.Bit of both I guess. I also would swap my Briks for a pair of NBLs tomorrow or buy some after the Supercap,Prefix,135s and some more Mana. All this assuming I had six grand spare.
I would also be very interested to hear from someone who has moved fom Briks or Kabers to NBLs or anyone who has heard NBLs head to head against Mana supported Isobariks.

Andrew,can you expand on correct operating conditons.What would the "best" conditons be?My listening room poses I think an interesting challenge;Length 12 feet,width 10 feet(with patio sliding doors!)The room configuration means I have speakers either side of the patio frames facing towards the solid wall(12 fee)One speaker is only 1 foot from the corner:would this be a problem for the sideways bass of the NBL?

Rog,

I can only offer you an educated guess on things, so here's my 2p worth.

1) Normally, speakers should be firing down the length of the room (with enough space at either side) - to maximise bass response. However, with the NBLs, space is required around the bass units to supply enough air mass. In this case I would suggest the 12 foot wall is best.
2) The back wall immediately behind the loudspeakers should be a solid outer wall - however the patio window is likely to be directly excited by the inward facing bass drivers.
3) Make sure there are no significant obstructions in between and to the sides of the 'speakers.

Conclusion. For NBLs, you would be best using the 12 foot wall opposite the patio. If it is a dividing wall, check whether breeze blocks are used.

Another idea is to keep your hi-fi component stands away from the halfway point along the length of the room. Doing so would keep the your components away from the 1st harmonic resonant node of the room.

Andrew

Andrew Randle
2B || !2B;
4 ^ = ?;

Finally, some NBL talk! I have owned NBLs for almost a year, starting passive w/ 135s and ending with an active six pack. In between my upgrades I was able to borrow a NAP 500 for a couple of days-- so I have been able to hear most of options available today. My NBLs were an upgrade from SBLs and offered greater scale and better seperation of instruments due to their three-way operation. While listening with a pair of 135s was good, I was not in store for what the 500 had to offer.

The 500 was amazing! The music was suddenly effortless, more tunefull, and faster. There was far more detail and it was easy to get lost in the recording. The 500 made my 135s sound broken. I knew something had to go.

On the advice of the NANA sales rep, I went for the six pack over a 500. It was cheaper and tweakable as I have a small listening room. On the first note I was instantly impressed with the active sound. I was blown away by the depth, and cohesion that now existed. It was everything the 500 did, except for the ultimate sense of effortlessness. So figured I had made it, but there was still one more upgrade.

Since I was trying to go active on the cheap, I settled for a Hi-cap for the Snaxo. BIG MISTAKE. I borrowed a Supercap for comparison and on first listen was transported to another world! Notes were now bigger, fatter, more round. Any sense of hardness, or fatuge was gone. The NBLs were imaging like crazy. The sound was both flat and round at the same time! This was better than the 500.

So, from this upgrade experience I can say NBLs (like all Naim speakers) demand the finest electronics available. They only really sing when active, and only with a supercap on the Snaxo. I can only imagine going active with three NAP 500s. It boggels the mind to consider that option.

Chris Bell

PS: Naim has redesigned the NBL PXO--I would like to hear it with a 500 some day soon!

Chris,

Great posting - good to hear an opinion of different configurations based on the same pair of NBLs.

Andrew

Andrew Randle
2B || !2B;
4 ^ = ?;

chris,do you know what prompted naim toredesign the nblpxo?Your post indicates to me that the nbl can give satisfaction at various levels of upgrade.An earlier repondee said they sounded great when he heard them through a 52/250 so I guess I could could get some pretty good response with my current set up.Naim recommend a 250 as minimum so I believe they must has designed them in the belief that they opened up a range of options to fit the purse of buyers.I heard them(briefly)once throughan82/180 and was impressed then,so I can only imagine how awesome yours must sound.Have you had any problems with siting the speakers,particlarly bearing in my the constraints of my room(thanks Andrew by the way for your ideas)Finally,Chris,would you say that even when your nbl's were passive they still outgunned the oppostion?Regards Rog