My current system is as follows:

1. Densen Beat CD
2. Musical Fidelity X-A1 Amplifier
3. Naim SBL's (s/h - Mark 1)
4. Interconnect = Chord Chorus
5. Speaker Cable = Blue Heaven
6. Sound Organisation Stand.

Still reading?

Taste in music is varied: Rock, Jazz, Classical, Blues.

The speakers are the most recent addition - more an accident really, needed speakers that were tolerant to a smallish room and wall siting - and have led me to consider a "final" upgrade (I have vowed not to get on the continual upgrade treadmill - but then who hasn't at some point!).

I thought the Amplifier would be the first to change and then maybe the CD - limited budget here guys, and the Densen sounds much better than the Marantz I had before!

I thought about the Nait 5, my local dealer recommended a 102/180 combination.

Query:

1. What would you change, and in what order, to get a good (but not utopian) system?

I'm interested to understand if the 102/180 is a good combination, or should I look at another? What about the cables?

2. What changes would provide the greatest musical impact.

3. Finally - it appears to me that the SBL's take quite sometime to "warm-up", once they do - they sing. Is this correct?

I appreciate that the system is not very, well "Naim", but your thoughts would be much appreciated

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2. What changes would provide the greatest musical impact.

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I would ditch the Musical Fidelity amp ASAP. I really hate these things as they seem to have virtually zero rhythmical ability whatsoever. My least fave amps of any I have heard. If you want a Naim amp ditch the speaker leads too - A5 is the tool for that job. I would go and listen to some, and get a feel for what you get at each price point.

The Densen Beat CD sounds very good indeed to my ears, it will definitely stand a very serious amp upgrade. Doubt it is worth comparing it to anything less than a CDX. I like Densen a lot.

Tony.

I recently bought a CD5. I compared this to the Densen amongst others but in the dem system, which was 102,180 and SBL's, the Densen sounded very harsh. It is definatly a very good player, probably better than the CD5, but I could not have lived with it.

Simon

I think a standard system would be SBLs - 250 or 135 for amps - hicap - 72/32.5/82/52 for preamp - LP12/CDX/CDS for source. Someusers say the SBL needs at least a 250; some say a Nait is OK.

So, as to what to change and in what order: 1) what's your budget? 2) what do you want most to change about the system you have now?

I suggest that you consider the 102/180 carefully and certainly take a listen before purchasing. I auditioned this pair and discovered that the sound became very harsh. I was using the 102 with a NAP 90 before and there was no problem. I then tried a NAP250 which works much better with a 102. Be aware that you would also then need a seperate power supply as the 250 can't power the 102.

I have heard 180's in other setups and they've sounded OK. I think it's a 102/180 issue.

Regards

Darren Miller

Jonathan

(PS Tony - I'm going to replace the MF amps, honest, but not until I can afford a 52/s'cap/500)

The MF is the weak link in my view. In terms of amplifiers, the Mark1's really benefit by having a 250 behind them. That said, they should cope with a 180 quite well. The new SBLs can be driven by the Nait5 since they're so clean and easy to drive and have a benign treble response. The old SBLs were a little more fastidious and could easily sound harsh. Combine this with the slightly up-front nature of the Densen and you could be in trouble! So - if you go for a 102/180, try to factor in a NAPSC to control the treble.

Regards,
Frank.

But -

1. The 102/180 has some detractors, unless I add an NAPSC - but tell me Frank, what is this (sorry for dumb questions) and what will it do exactly?

2. Further, a few comments recommend a 250 instead of a 180 - will this work well with the 102?

3. Would the SBL's sound significantly better with the 250?

4. And what is the separate power supply requirement? Another box!

5. How would it compare with a 52/250 or 82/250?

6. What's the Densen daughter board upgrade? What does it do?

Appreciate the comments to-date, just need more data!

how would the new 112/150 combo fit into this setup.

Have you heard these, yet?

cheers, Martin

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PS Tony - I'm going to replace the MF amps, honest, but not until I can afford a 52/s'cap/500

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Get a Nait Mk1 or 2, 42/110, Onix OA21 (an amp from my past – stunning), Myst, Incatech, any cheap Exposure, bloody anything except MF. Any of these will cost you less to buy than the resale value of the MF amp, and will depreciate no more while you own them, any of them will sound so much better you will be truly shocked. Woah, music that plays in time... bloody hell.

I have read interviews with Anthony Michaelson where he states bass tightness is over rated, and that most transistor amps are "over damped". This guy would not recognise a good bassist if hit in the face with a double bass by Charlie Mingus. Total musical illiterate, file under Russ Andrews.

Tony.

Why not keep an eye on the secondhand market for either a 32.5, 42.5 or 62 (depending on the number of inputs you need) and a 110, 140 or 160. Then when you have got used to this little lot check-out the 102/180 and if you like and think it's a big enough improvement you can sell the secondhand bits for (probably) no lose. If not keep the old boxes and lookout for a psu for the pre-amp.

Oh and as no-one else has mentioned it, your stand is really holding all of your kit back.

Zob

I'm going for the source first aproach and I'm going to see how fast I can get to CDSII/52/500 - which means not buying anything inbetween.

Next stage is CDSII early next year - or earlier if I get some good news from my tax return calculation / next bonus.

BTW : the sax on girl from ippanema is in the centre, not left as I had stated. I was getting it mixed up ... though when listening it was interesting to see where the various people had been put (Gilberto and Stan front and center when playing and singing - but Astrud G on the hard right... but, hey - you can't check that out in mono!) and the two 45 releases included on the CD have everything squahed in the centre .. but still manage to sound interesting in the right places - and on the 45 release of TGFI you only get Gilberto's dum-de-dum andf the English version from Astrud .. shame !!

I'll stop rambling NOW.

Jonathan