I'm in the market for a new turntable. I see that the Technics SL1200 is going through something of a renaissance in HiFi circles, at least on some internet sites. Normally I'd be wary of that, but I used one many moons ago and thought it then to be a good, solid machine.

Anyone know how it compares to the Regas and Pro-jects or other turntables at the same price? Also, what would be a good cartridge?

quote:

Originally posted by avole:
Anyone know how it compares to the Regas and Pro-jects or other turntables at the same price? Also, what would be a good cartridge?

David Price in Hi FI World has been raving about it for a year or more. He rates it higher than mid-price Regas, but only when it's got a better (Rega!) arm fitted.
Personally I have no idea, but my gut feel is that direct drive and idler drive turntables at their best can do things with LP that belt-drives can't. My first ever deck was a lovely Garrard 4HF (sniff...)

rupert bear said:

quote:

I have no idea, but my gut feel is that direct drive and idler drive turntables at their best can do things with LP that belt-drives can't. My first ever deck was a lovely Garrard 4HF

Hi Rupert,

Correct, they can do damage to the music. Hence their place in history. Gut feelings and nostalgia from someone who admits "I have no idea" cannot alter the march of progress.

I suggest avole get a used LP12, he will not regret it.

Bob

Great machines if you're a DJ...otherwise a Planar 2/3 will be much better, but as Bob suggested, try to stretch to a used LP12 and get it serviced/setup.

Gary.

Bob, I see you're located in Germany. Have you any information about these turntables:

http://www.elektrotechnik-inderbeek.de/index.html

I take your point about the LP12 - I've bid on a couple on ebay but missed out, which is one of the reasons I'm looking at other marques.

quote:

Bob, I see you're located in Germany. Have you any information about these turntables:

Hi avole,

Sorry, no. Do try to persevere with the LP12 though, it will be worth it in the end.

Bob

p.s. Welcome to the Forum!

Avole

Nothing wrong with the SL1200. This one I have just sold and now doing a 1210 (fancied black!). I have an LP12 too but there is something about the 1200 with the correct mat, isolation and arm/cartridge gives a very tight rythmic sound with spot on stability. I really enjoy Depeche Mode on this deck!

ATB

John

If you can't stretch to the Modded Audio Origami RB250, The deck will work well with the RB300 and you can mod it when funds allow.

ATB

John

On the other hand...........

LP12 Doctored by Dr Peter (Cybiosis)

Audio Origami SME 3009 Rewire
Lovely maple surround
Dynavector 17d3
Acrylic base
Hurcules psu

It's endless...........

avole,

I think it depends on how far you want to go with an analogue playback.

I also still rate an SL1200 ( I used to own one as well as SL1300 ). It has a very different presentation to a suspended deck so you need to know what you want out of a record player.

I haven't gone nuts as John P but out of nostalgia, I've scored an old SL1300 ( this is an automatic version of an SL1200 sans quartz lock )

It's doodle to set up and pretty fun pounding dance/disco tunes.

I reckon the stock arm should take a cartridge up to 150$USD or so. I've no plan to fit Miyabi or Akiva on it.

The problem of buying a Sondek second hand is that you do need someone who knows what they are doing to set it up correctly.

Good thing about both brands is that since they are still in production, parts are easy to source.

Have fun!

Sorry Peter, CYMBIOSIS. Sunday spelling

With respect the SL1300, 1400 & 1500 are related but are not the same as the SL1200. The SL1200 is a notch above them in quality, IIRC.

For what matters in music, i.e. pitch stability, timing and overall organisation of all the parts of a musical performance there's hardly anything to touch an SL1200 at anything near it's price point.

I recently moved from a Garrard 401, which I have always preferred to any beldrive wobble deck, and I certainly don't regret it.

I would say that the area where a Teccie falls down in cmparison with the more traditional choices is in the higher frequencies where it sounds a bit dull.

regards

Peter

ooops, duplicate post

quote:

Originally posted by Goldstar: Gut feelings and nostalgia from someone who admits "I have no idea" cannot alter the march of progress.Bob

I suppose using that phrase was begging for a reply like that. Of course, I meant 'I have no idea about the Technics (as I haven't used one), but feel that direct-drives (etc) can do something (positive) to the music which a belt-drive can't'. Sorry I had to spell this out.

Julian Vereker once said (and I paraphrase) that the only reason he thought CD could prove superior to LP was that the moment you applied a downward force (arm/cartridge) to an LP you slowed down the deck. I would have thought that, whatever their merits in reality, the theory would be that D/Ds could be superior, since they are more likely to maintain absolute speed stability and therefore time better. Probably.

And really, there's no need to be rude.

quote:

Originally posted by rupert bear:
I would have thought that, whatever their merits in reality, the theory would be that D/Ds could be superior, since they are more likely to maintain absolute speed stability and therefore time better. Probably.

The answer for the Technics SL1200 & SL1210 MK2 is definately! IME.

Peter,

Which arm and cartridge do you use on your SL1200?

The 1200 is a solid deck. Built like a tank and has been the pretty much the same for the last 20 years. There are several mods you can do to them as stated before. If you throw on a good arm and a good cart. with a solid pre. you can't really go wrong. the 1200 still fetches good value on the resale market as well. It still needs to be calibrated every once in a while to keep the motor from drifting to much but even a lp12 drifts too.


cheers
PF

quote:

Originally posted by rupert bear:

Personally I have no idea, but my gut feel is that direct drive and idler drive turntables at their best can do things with LP that belt-drives can't.

Totally agree

The direct drive motor and lightish platter causes the direct drive motor pulses to be translated straight into intermod distortion. So thats somthing that belt-drives cant do.

As for idler drive, it puts lots of low frequency noise into the platter/replay which causes lots of intermod distortion, let alone complete bass confusion. So thats something that belt-drives cant do either!

There are very good reasons why SL1200s et alia are used in radio stations and by djs. Cos they can slip cue, have almost instant start up, and are super-reliable in the face of gorilla handling.

There are very good reasons why direct drive isnt used in high-end analogue turntables.

There are very good reasons why idler drive is dead -- it was rubbish.

Oh I know a 401 (preferably a 301 for that period look) with SME 3012 looks fantastic. But so did Marilyn Monroe when she was young too. And look at her now...

;-)

Plus you can cut and scratch or mix with you're bathroom sink or brick hod ect... if you so desire.

Thanks Jon, I agree that the old Garrard and Thorens decks are left wanting these days.

It's interesting though that various people have tried to revive these methods or bring them up the audio scale. For example, Garrard designed the 501 from scratch using the idler principle - and used an ARO on it! More recently Brinkmann in Germany have introduced a DD deck (the Oasis). I do understand the principle of energy transmission, but surely a £10 rubber band can be bettered as a drive mechanism?

Anyway, going back to the original questioner, I'd just buy a Rega P3-24 and have done with it.