hello

i am catalin from romania, and for quite awhile i've been into naim sound.

i will recently upgrade the system which now consist of cd 5i / sugden a21a / proac studio 140 (upgraded from previous 5i/nait 5i/ spendor s3/5r)...

my request to you naimees will be a strong advice about the right speakers and cables for the future system, which will consist of 5x with flatcap powered by a supernait...

my choices would be 2 Sonus faber pairs : the Cremona M floorstander, and the Guarneri memento bookshelf...

the problem is i've listened to 5x/flatcap/supernait/cremona and sounds delicios, with lots of airiness and especially vocal detail and very natural timbre... a huge system in terms of ... everyting... i'm speachless...

we've combined even with bryston b4sst amplification or with sugden msterclass transport and jadis DAC, but the real magic was with 5x/supernait.

i don't really know how the guarneris sound, the dealer does not have them for the moment...
my guess is that will be a plus on refinement over the cremonas, but a litle short on authority (still it is a bookshelf compared to a floorstand although in a highr class and with extra 2000 eur to be charged)

so i amlooking for some advice from you experienced naim guys, and also, for this 2 setups based on 5x/supernait some cable recommendations would be fine...

the local Naim/SF dealer is also a chord and kimber dealer and the advice was into some kimber combination, but, nevertheless, some hints would be useful and much appreciated...

thank you very much and i expect to have soon some pictures to post and to be proud of...

Hi Catalin, and welcome.

I have the Guarneri Memento and SF speakers for some 15 years. The Memento will make the Cremona sound like shouty shoeboxes. This is not to be rude but the difference is that big. Like the other SF speakers from the Homage series, the Guarneri Memento is a magic speaker. Eminently beautiful and musical. The SF Homage series is a very different level of quality (and price) than the other series.

I do think a Supernait is on the low-end side to drive Mementos' properly. They deserve better amplification to make them sing. I use them with a 102/180 combo and that's a minimum imo (just). I bought them with plenty room for future growth.

Richard.

Hi Catalin;

Congratulations on you new black boxes in advance I am looking forward to the pictures you have promised. I have no experience with S.F. speakers but maybe I can be of help regarding cables. I have experienced with a few chord cables and while they are fine, the standard Naim cables just perform better and more naturally. For speaker cables stick with Naca5. If you want a different interconnect between the CD5x and the supernait then consider the hiline. However, I think it would be better and also more fun to take the combo home and use it for several months. Allow for break in and allow yourself to get familiar with the sound too. After several months, if you still feel the need to upgrade the cables, have a demo of the hiline and see if you like it.

Regards...

quote:

Originally posted by Flame: For speaker cables stick with Naca5.

A personal view. Shared by many here but not a fact nonetheless. I don't agree, especially not with SF speakers.

Richard.

Catalin,

My current system is the Supernait/FC2x/CD5x/SF Cremona Auditor/REL 3.5 sub/NACA-5 (FC2x powering both CD5x/SN). I have been really happy with this system. Those speakers are a really great value for performance (half the price of the mementos)and the sub just adds tremendously to the soundstage and midrange. I happen to disagree with many forum members who I feel under-rate the SN. IMO it's an entry level reference piece of kit and according to my dealer very, very close to the 202/200/NAPSC/HC, but without the flakiness they find with the 202/200. I also like the FC2x with the SN as opposed to the HC--more musical as I feel the HC is too heavy and slow. It just really sounds good with all types of music.

To get the best performance from the system, if possible, use a dedicated in-phase mains supply. A good stereo stand, I bought a quadraspire and was really happy at the difference it made and for not a lot of $$. Definitely start with the regular Naim power cords/Snaic and get used to the system before considering any change for power-line/Hi-line.

Enjoy, you'll be very happy

Gary,

Your Cremona Auditors are very different from the Cremona floorstanders. The monitors are much better and one of my favorites. You took the right model and I'm convinced they sound great on the SNait. Seems like a well balanced marriage.

From what I've heard the SNait is definitely not very close to a 202/200/Hi/NAPSC combo.

Richard.

quote:

the problem is i've listened to 5x/flatcap/supernait/cremona and sounds delicios, with lots of airiness and especially vocal detail and very natural timbre... a huge system in terms of ... everyting... i'm speachless...

Catalin,

Firstly I'll say that the new Cremona's sound quite different from the previous models with quite a more vivid, fast and lively sound...
From what I heard it seems like both Cremona M, Auditor and floorstanders are tremendous speakers, and they could be a perfect match with a SN amplification. If I was in your shoes I would go for the Cremona's you listned to with your future system, as you really liked what you've heard. Unless you can have a succesfull demo with the Memento don't buy them blind, as they will sound quite different and may not be to your taste, moreover the Cremona should match better your amplification. BTW I saw both Cremonas in Graphite finish...Beautiful, classy and fashion looking

When it's come to knowing how the SN does vs 202/200, opinions varie from one to an another, it very well be a matter of taste and need, as the quality of those two amplifications should be in the same league.

Regards,
Edouard

quote:

Originally posted by Edouard: When it's come to knowing how the SN does vs 202/200, opinions varie from one to an another, it very well be a matter of taste and need, as the quality of those two amplifications should be in the same league.

I find that amazing Edouard. I've listened to the SN/Hi and 202/200/Hi back to back on Cremona Auditors and I think the 200 combo plays in a different league altogether.

Richard.

quote:

I've listened to the SN/Hi and 202/200/Hi back to back on Cremona Auditors and I think the 200 combo plays in a different league altogether.

Richard,

Your opinion is valid, mine is not, as I didn't have the demo.
Never the less, based on other opinions from people who actually had the demo, opinions do vary, and I believe that even though the 202/200 combo might be better, it should not be miles better than the SN. Actually the voicing of those 2 amps are different and some prefer one the other.

Regards,
Edouard

Very hard to believe if you have heard both with the same source on the same speakers in the same room right after each other.

Would be strange from a product positioning point of view too. A one box solution including a dac that sounds only different but just as good as a considerably more expensive separate pre/power combo.

I didn't hear that at all. I wish I did tough...


Richard.

My current setup includes CDX2(on Mana rack)/Hiline/Powerline/Nait 5i/NACA5(F-terminal)/Sonus Faber Electa Amator 1.I used to drive SF EA1 with 72/HC/180 with CDi as source.Also I have borrowed S-Nait from dealer to replace Nait 5i to see how it goes.Of the 3 different setups with the same pair of Sonus Faber speakers,I like the S-Nait the most.The music just flows out of the speakers with ease.S-Nait simply provides much more "atmosphire"around each instrument or vocal.Every thing is more under controlled and natural.I do not have the chance to pair CDX2 with 72/HC/180 so maybe it's because the source which restricts 72/HC/180 from performing.As for Cremona vs. Guarneri,I would not consider Cremona series unless you are very bass hungry.The performace level is simply not in the same league,just like to comepare EA1 with Concertos.The Guarneri is simply a classic.

well, thank you guys for your kind replies...
after several testing and trying sessions, i've decided to stick with the system that i enjoyed so much in the showroom...

that is 5x/flatcap2x/supernait/cremona m.

i will try to post some pics over the system pics session...

cabling and racking is not quite the definitive solution, and neither the power... i will upgrade in the future these "small" items. for now for my own ears and not putting aside some major budget for it, a kimber interconnect and a chord cable plus the flatcap were all i could deal with and all that i liked the most...

we tried of course the Naim cabling, and although the combnation is a foar one and imaging seemed alittle more focused, with kimber/chord it tends to be a little more joyful...

we even brought the system to my home - as any serious dealer would do at this price tag - and tried it, and actually modified some of the room's arrangement to make the best of it...

i am very pleased now - and i can tell you, i am a very hard person to please when it comes to audio and music...

i am lisening right now to antonio forcione's "dedicato" and everything i just right and musical, although the level is quite low... a fine system on my standards, and a combination that i strongly recommend for the money, being so familiar with most of Naim's range, and also a lot of other brit hifi great names...

Edouard, hope some day when you will trade off your s3/552/300/amati system for a 555/552/500/stradivari you will give me a call, and make me an offer i could not refuse...

thank you all and God bless you and your black'n olive boxes!!!

Congrats on your new gear Catalin. And welcome to the SF club.

quote:

Originally posted by lihantung:
My current setup includes CDX2(on Mana rack)/Hiline/Powerline/Nait 5i/NACA5(F-terminal)/Sonus Faber Electa Amator 1.

I've had the Electa Amator II for many years. Brilliant speaker. Amazing that you drive the EA1 with a Nait though. The EA2 was a much easier load on the amp than the EA1 but still not easy. My 102/Hi/180 had a tough time with them. When the volume reached 11 o'clock the 180 started to collapse.

Don't sell the EA1 too quickly. They are classics from the time that SF had a hard to define magic that a lot of the current designs seem to miss. My dealer welcomed my EA2s with open arms and returned me a top price after 8 years when I bought the Guarneri Mementos. They were gone the same day.

Richard.

quote:

Edouard, hope some day when you will trade off your s3/552/300/Amati system for...

It won't be anytime soon Catalin, hifi will have to move forward dramatically for me to make any change in my system

Congratulations on your beautifull system, what colour are your Cremona's?
Waiting for the pics,

Regards,
Edouard

i've posted a pic on the dedicated thread... the cremonas are on the light finish not the dark one...
i am not very picky with speaker finishes... the SF line is beutifully shaped in any of the finishes, so if i would get the dark graphite finish i would have been as happy as i am with my own...
the finish is ok, but the sound... delicios!

i am picky with some electronics finishes though - and that is i have become quite allergic to too fancy designs...

seriously, i am dazzled positively by the naim's commitment to stick with a serious black finish, and not pass onto the usual boring titanium or aluminum finishes, which have started to became annoing...

the fact that they don't have a standby button, the fact that only the Naim name stands in the front and not the model name which is always on the rear panel, is like talking to someone and they ask you "what car you own?" and if you say like toyota or ford you will be asked "what model?" but if you say "a ferrari" it won't matter anymore...

i get the similar feeling with the naims... i say "naim system" - it is enough... the details are just for us - the naimees...

all the best!

Catalin, If you like Antonio Forcionne you should have a listen to "Vento del Sud." It's in italian so I don't understand a word, but it is a beautiful CD and made really well. It should sound great on your new system. I can't wait to hear this at 24/96.

PS: you said your dealer helped with room dynamics. I needed to fuss around a little as well and added a few acoustic panels to help with reverb. I would add that a dedicated mains would be in order for your system if possible. I also bought a quadraspire rack and it made quite a difference as well and is reasonably priced. No fraim for me--too expensive.

Enjoy