morning all, very quick query this.....i have shahinan compass which are about 2.5 years old and i have reserved a pair of arcs from a local dealer which are ex dem, im wondering "just how much better are the arcs" i can borrow them for home dem but i have to sell the idea to my partner as we all do and im after a bit of help, they are not quite as lovely to look at as the compass so they will need to shine in order to be accepted! im hoping to sell my compass for around £1250 which will cover about 2/3 of the cost of the arcs. other components in the system are cdx/xps, 52/super, 180, all on fraim. many thanks, - gus

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just how much better are the arcs

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Hopefully the answer is a lot, as I wasn't impressed too much by my Compasses (now sold). Then again, maybe that's just me not getting on with the 'Shahinian Sound'...

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im hoping to sell my compass for around £1250

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Seems quite a bit. I sold my three year old pair (with 2000 spec drivers) for £650 including courier in mint- condition in oak. I'm sure (by the amount of interest my ad had) that I could have made £800 or maybe a little more, but I think £1250 would be expensive for these speakers as generally their performance is commensurate with that of a £1500 speaker and probably no more than that, IMHO..

For what it's worth I paid a little under £400 for my pair from a dealer, aged around 2.5 years when I bought them. So, I made a small profit on them, but I think you'd be hard pushed to make £1250. I really hope you do, though, it would be great for you...

TC '..'
"Girl, you thought he was a man, but he was a Muffin..."

hi kit,
i do seem to remember you saying that they were fantastic when you had them but yes, taste does change with time, the compass is now retailing at around £2700, 2 large price hikes in the last year so i think that £1250 is reasonable enough at less than 50% or retail and as far as i know no driver units have been changed since mine were bought. I wouldnt be upgrading if it wasnt for the proverbial carrot on a stick being dangled in front of me.....

Gus
Don't worry, Arcs are miles better than Compass. Even being a Shahinian fan, I didn't get on totally with Compass. For me, a no brainer really.

They should sound pretty good on the end of a 52/SC/180, a safe upgrade IMHO.

Cheers
Goose

...I submit that there is no problem here.

"they are not quite as lovely to look at as the compass so they will need to shine in order to be accepted!"

Because if they *don't* shine, then you wouldn't want them for the extra cash outlay either, right?

So maybe the two of you can make the decision together rather than from a position of trying to sell her on it.

- GregB

Insert Witty Signature Line Here

Goose,
Out of interest why didn't you get on with the Compass? I've had a pair for nearly five years now and on the whole like them with the exception that they sound very laid back unless played loud. This may be due to my amp as I am still stuck on a NAP90 and having tried them with a 250 on home demo I can see (hear!) that they are not really being driven properly. It seems that at low volume they struggle to reproduce higher frquencies with any "strength" - a friend commented that the treble is "missing" - did you encounter this?
Rgds,
Tom

Gus,

The Arcs are far better than the Compasses. There's more bass control, generally more refinement and they are more open.

You will like them.

Just don't listen to the Obelisks or you'll be unhappy with any other speaker, apart from the Hawks.

With the current price of Compasses at £2,700, you should have little problem getting £1,250, but as Top Cat said, I don't think they're worth it.

Arcs will be the best thing you ever bought; they will change your listening life.

In terms of WAF, my wife, who couldn't give a s**t about hi-fi, was so hugely impressed by the aural improvements overs my SBLs that she welcomed them into the house with open arms - your partner will love them.

Steve

Gus

The arcs are much more involving than compasses in every way. I've found that you need a 180 minimum to drive them, so you're in the right territory.

How old are the Arcs that you are considering? There was a major update a few years ago with a new passive radiator design and reinfirced internal bracing. The passive radiator design improved low end control significantly so try and go for one with those changes.

Still can't believe that Compasses in the UK cost £2700. I remember buying my Arcs ex-dem from Infidelity for £1200 when Compasses were selling for around a grand! Talk about inflation...

Afzal.

I listened to them a few years ago and being very familiar with Arcs felt there was something 'missing', sort of like your friend described..

I love the concept of a massive soundstage, but just felt they lacked a bit of 'bite'. I would still probably own them over most other conventional speakers though. I feel the Compass may not be as good value now, but I feel that their other speakers in the range are still great, they were really too cheap before (??).... Look at the amount of drive units you get in a pair of Obs/Hawks/Diapasons and the quality of the finland birch!!

Cheers
Goose

Shahinian's have a very distinctive sound.
Because of their dispersion patterns they are very room dependent.

Best bet is to try at home before buying.

I've heard both the Arcs and the Obelsiks and both are too colored for me.

The big Diapasion tweeter/mids with Hawks or Double Eagles however are on another plane of performance from the small fry and are much more satisfying to my ears.


cheerio

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The big Diapasion tweeter/mids with Hawks or Double Eagles however are on another plane of performance from the small fry and are much more satisfying to my ears.

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They are also on another price plane. Anyone actually spent £8,000 - £13,000 on speakers?

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I've heard both the Arcs and the Obelsiks and both are too colored for me.

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Interesting. One of the factors that led me to buy Obelisks was their lack of colour - things sounded tonally much more correct than the other speakers I tried (Wilson Benesch, Living Voice, PMC) and in my room at leasst, they were much better than the Hawks, whose bass was disconnected and they made pianos sound steely!

Hey ho.

Yeah, as Nick L says I find them very uncoloured in comparisson to most speakers, granted the presentation is different, but 'coloured' is not a phrase that I would use at all!

I am not sure what went wrong with your experience Mr Lees, but I can guarantee you that they do not have a disconnected bass and are not steely with pianos!! :-).. Hey ho indeed! PS any new Prog around Nick?? apart from Spocks/PT?

Cheers
Goose

On a separate issue - has anyone heard the L300 yet? Any news on price?

David

Mr Goose said:

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I am not sure what went wrong with your experience Mr Lees, but I can guarantee you that they do not have a disconnected bass and are not steely with pianos!!

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I had the whole Shahinian/Dynavector mafia on my case with this demo! I had the Hawks for a week and at the end was thrilled to get rid of them.

There was a lot of dark muttering about 135s not being up to the job of running them and that I should be switching to a DV HX1.2, but even Pear Audio admitted that, if the 135s were having a tough time with the Hawks they'd have had the same sort of struggle with the Obelisks....and they didn't/don't.

I managed to get rid of much of the steeliness by going against all recommendations and bi-wiring them with NACA5 rather than the posh Kimber umbilical supplied (we even tried less posh Kimber), but they were never in the Obelisks' league for sheer musicality. The bass may have been a room thing - the greater output of the Hawks exciting room nodes and all that stuff.

Oh, and they were £3,000 more expensive!

Mr. Goose also said:

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PS any new Prog around Nick?? apart from Spocks/PT?

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Sadly not - I've been side-tracked by a whole bunch of good stuff recommended in the Music Room, though I do intend to expand my Landberk collection thanks to you!

Yesterday I got the new Lemon Jelly (good), In A Silent Way (the new re-remaster or whatever, sublime - thanks to DH-M), and tried hard to buy some Reger String Quartets (courtesy of Herm) and Mompou piano (courtesy me) but none of the London stores I visited had any.

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I am not sure what went wrong with your experience Mr Lees, but I can guarantee you that they do not have a disconnected bass and are not steely with pianos!!

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Goose, you have to remember that Nick was probably banging a tea-cup at the time to imitate the sound of the loose change in the pianists pocket.

David

Interesting comments guys.

Did most of you use Naim amps by any chance ?

I listened to the Shahinians using amps like ARC, Quicksilver, Dynavector and Plinius.

The best sound came with the big Plinius combination.


cheerio

I am currently using my Obelisks with a 140 Power Amp (whilst my 250 is getting serviced), and the 140 is having no problems at all! The rest of the system is LP12, CDSII, 82/Supercap.

I prefer the better bass response and the ability to fill the room with sound rather than my SBLs. I would say the midband isn't as neutral as the SBLs though.

Darryl.

well the jury is still out on this one.....ive borrowed them from my dealer for a few days/week or so.......when i first put them in the living room my first reaction was that they sounded really closed in and a bit muffled......i think that the treble unit might be slightly faulty, but after a few beers (nothing ever sounds good straight after coming home from work) they started to sound pretty amazing even with slightly duff treble, the bass response is absolutely amazing and nothing ive ever heard before, apart from nbls sounds quite as good. however i found a big note on them later saying "get these hideous monstrosities out of my lounge - they are even uglier than on shahinians website - they are just vile" so i think no matter how they sound when the treble unit is repaired they wont be residing in my living room. it has got to be said though that some things sounded better on the compasses and some things sounded better on the epos es14's which are still an amazing speaker. the other problem with them will be the fact that i have a terraced house and i did hear the neighbours knocking on the door inbetween tracks so i dont think they would be too appreciative if i went ahead and bought them. so all in all i think that they are great speakers but not for me......they need a big room (i think) probably a non suspended floor and a 70's decor orientated partner. so im going to keep the compass' as nothing is particularly wrong with them and im going to save my pennies for a pair of second hand 135's......unless of course anybody has some piano black sbl's...........