strange - I was spinning 'So' just now - warming up the NBLs but that's another story to come....
I like the way you've hidden the olive boxes in the other room - a cheaper solution to upgrading to 500s

Now that's just plain spooky John I look forward to hearing about your NBLs.

Nero,

I would be concerned obviously if Brad was using NBL's in his room with his current system layout, but given he is using the Bricks, I feel it is a very good compromise and given the performance achieved, it is certainly not suffering any ill effects.

Brad's other option would be to have the complete system at the other end of the room near his listening position and I feel there are several disadvantages to this.

1) Introducing a large number of boxes with big transformers will, inevitably introduce more mechanical noise into Brad's room. Brad is in a country area, where the mains could well be an issue, although it was fine when I visited.

2) I'm not keen on running all the necessary speaker cables closely together along the length of one side of the room(for cosmetic reasons these would inevitably need to be bunched or grouped tightly together)- not good in my experience!

3) Bringing in another complete rack of equipment into what is a nice simple and uncluttered room and basically having to move a sofa closer to the speakers. At present the room looks in balance and sounds so too.

I hope this explains why the layout Brad has chosen is in my mind the best. Certainly the benefits the Fraim brought to the proceedings indicate everything is very happy situated just where it is.

Kind regards,

Peter

Peter, I'm sure you knew what you were doing, so it wasn't a criticism - my efforts would be naive by comparison. I also wish I had the opportunity to get the amps into a different room, but unless Naim come up with a waterproof option, they'd be a bit exposed in the garden

quote:

2) I'm not keen on running all the necessary speaker cables closely together along the length of one side of the room(for cosmetic reasons these would inevitably need to be bunched or grouped tightly together)- not good in my experience!

This is an issue I have to face during my active NBL installation, and the aesthetics of 6 lengths of NACA5 does not have much WAF. I feel a bit cheeky asking this, as I've not bought anything from you (yet ), but do you have any suggestions as to how to improve the situation. I guess bunching them together will cause some interference between the channels which an active system is designed to avoid in the first place!

Brad
I hope to have the NBLs up and running in the next few days, so I'll post a report vs. the Briks in due course

Hi Nero,

I didn't think for a second you were making a serious criticism - not at all. By answering fully I was just trying to give you a bit more on the background, rather than the usual yes or no! And, it's obviously caught your interest in the cable bunching issue. The best simple easy to do suggestion is for you to spread them out and judge the differences/improvements for yourself, and then work out how you are going to space them under the carpet.......Assuming you have a carpeted floor?

Happy to advise you further on this one.

Kind regards

Peter

At the risk of sounding like a gushing Oscar winner, a couple of acknowledgements are called for here. Firstly, a big “thank you” to Brad for the initiative in instigating this visit and all the efforts in bringing it to fruition.. Secondly, an equally gargantuan “ta” to Peter; not just for his hi-fi related efforts but also for helping me out of a hole over my nephew’s work experience placement – and for being a “top man” with my two boys.

With my wife away on a shopping trip to New York, I was keeping all the balls in the air on Monday morning and getting things organised for school … until, with a few minutes to go, both boys decided they wanted to take their rather deflated footballs with them. Peter stepped up to the plate and solved the issue with what I suspect is his customary unflappability: a case of all hands to the pump – literally!

Peter: I hope your stay was comfortable and enjoyable. You are welcome here anytime.

I can testify to the positive effects on Brad’s system – and that’s without hearing the full extent of the changes. I had to leave early on both Sunday and Monday, so I have heard the work-in-progress but not the finished article – but what I heard was very impressive. For a year or more now Brad has been saying to me that he felt his LP12 was not giving its best and this exercise proved him right. The improvement post-Peter was stunningly obvious in the first 10 seconds of the first track; detailed, crisp, coherent, accurate, “tight”, musical and generally foot-tappingly brilliant.

Brad is now radiating a palpable sense of contentment and has the air of a man at peace with the world – and so it should be. His system is sounding absolutely fantastic and I both congratulate him and wish him many, many hours of enjoyment (and I look forward eagerly to our next session at his place).

Tuesday at my place was an interesting time for me. In contrast to Brad, I knew there were issues with the set-up of my system. I had “thrown” it together in a hurry in the very small hours of Xmas Eve 2003 (and found myself ‘one snaic short of a six-pack’, so to speak) and, despite the best of intentions, had never got around to doing much to it since then. Some of the things that Peter highlighted, however, came as a surprise to me; particularly the innovative use of an allen key.

Feeling suitably chastened, I left Peter to work his magic. The system now looks much tidier and there is noticeable orderliness to all of the cables as opposed to the random ‘plate of spaghetti’ that existed before. We also took the opportunity to remove the cassette deck and cheapo tuner that had sat on the rack for nearly three years without ever being plugged in.

As for the acid test of how it sounds, the answer is “better”. The key word, to plagiarise from Brad, is “tight” and all of his comments about the leading edge and attack on notes and how notes start and stop apply with equal force. I felt my sound was fairly good before, but there is now an extra level of beguiling crispness and an increased sense of effortless ease about the presentation of both the individual parts and the whole. Subtle changes in tone, timbre and even rhythm are more accessible without being dramatised. Interestingly, I feel that the improvement is greater on CD replay than with vinyl, which suggests to me that the system tune-up has had a bigger effect than the LP12 tune-up. I was irrationally pleased (as if I had anything to do with it!) when Peter commented that my TT was the best set-up of the ones he had seen on this trip. That probably explains why the improvement on vinyl is less noticeable than on CD.

I was especially interested, and a little apprehensive, to get Peter’s views on my listening room. It’s on the top floor of three, with the result that the roof line comes into play to some degree. Behind the speakers the wall rises vertically for about 4½ - 5 feet and then slopes inward at approx. 45 degrees until it meets the ceiling. With the upward-firing tweeters and mid units in the ‘Briks, I have always felt that this has a significant effect. My speaker placement is certainly non-standard for ‘Briks, being some 20 inches away from the rear wall. I settled on this positioning by simple trial-and-error and reliance on my ears. Peter felt that my positioning was pretty much ‘spot on’ for the room as it currently stands. He expressed the view that the slope behind and above the speakers was projecting the top end and mid-range somewhat and even over-emphasising those elements of the sound. His actual words were that the top and mid were “a bit shouty” but I like to think that was an over-dramatisation to get his point across.

The fact remains that the system sounds very good, and better following Peter’s ministrations, and it is now a question of getting it to sound even better still and realising its full potential. He had some useful suggestions to make regarding how to deal with any ‘projection effect’ from the slope and I will be giving them a go fairly soon; probably early in the new year. Peter believes that once these measures are in place it should be possible to move the speakers back a few inches and that this will result in further improvement. Until then, I am continuing to enjoy the marvellous sound I have.

In conclusion, it was a very educational and enjoyable, if slightly frantic, three days and I think all of us in NI gained from the visit. So, thanks again to Brad and to Peter – and I hope I didn’t scare you too much during the “burn” across the back roads of County Down.

One final question: how, exactly, does a bastard boogie?

Dan

One would suppose the correct way of describing Brads rig is that 'motors along quite nicely'!?!

Excellent write up Dan, its always nice to see someones hard work pays of.

Regards

PB

Hi Dan,

Super write up and you are more than welcome - I am glad that you were able to benefit from the visit too.

As for the title of the thread, it is a direct descriptive quote from the guru. It is a tad more accurate end evokes a clearer impression than just saying the system sounds nice

Brad

Zen and the art of system set-up:

What is the sound of a bastard boogie-ing?

Dan

First of all I would like to thank Brad & Dan for the invitation to have my TT fettled with ,if thats the appropriate word , during Peters visit to N.Ireland .Peter gave me several tips regarding my system apart from almost reassembling my TT,whilst doing this we discovered that the Valhalla may be on its last legs, as one of the capacitors is leaking ,unfortunately Peter did not bring any Hercules with him although he did bring FOUR of everything else ,otherwise my TT would now be sporting a new PS unit.After resetting the TT Peter tried the Bounce ,but it sounded like creaking bedsprings, he soon discovered that although new springs had been fitted when I had the Ekos fitted a few years ago ,the old washers & grommets had been retained ,needless to afterwards it was bouncing nicely .
One of the revelations of the day was how different the sound of the TT was depending on which side of the felt mat was used !.
I left Dans about 18.45 on Tuesday arrived home approximately 25 mins later put the TT back on its shelf ,lifted off the lid first up was my copy of "Brothers in Arms " sounding better than I had heard it before, apart from Dans that is ,he is in for a bit of a culture shock when he & Brad eventually get to hear my system , I think the best part of my system may be the room !
I retired to bed at 02.45 knowing that I now had to rediscover my record collection all over again, thanks Peter I will be in touch soon about the PS.......Jim

quote:

Originally posted by Blueknowz:
.......,whilst doing this we discovered that the Valhalla may be on its last legs, as one of the capacitors is leaking Jim

Jim

This is exactly what was found to be wrong with my LP12 when I had it rebuilt in the summer. This is what led me to audition the Linned v Naimed LP12s as outlined in my thread on this page.

And as you have found it does make a massive difference when the turntable is set up properly. You are quite right to say uou will be rediscovering your record collection.

Best of luck

Mark

Very happy to have been of service gentlemen. I'm very pleased you are all so happy with the results of my work. - Enjoy

Kind regards,

Peter

As suggested by Peter, here is a full frontal:

[IMG:left] [/IMG]

Nice picture Brad showing everything in context.

I'm glad to see the uplighter has now been returned to it's normal abode.

Mr MG Bear definately needs to stay on the sofa as I can still see the paw/leg print on the top grille of your left hand Brik!

Kind regards,

Peter

Excellent photo Brad, it put the room into context.

Regards

PB

Nice. That black Fraim actually makes the Briks look just right
Regards
John

I've really enjoyed the unfolding of the exploits and results of Peter's visit. It looks great Brad, and bet it sounds it.

Thanks for being gentle with Peter, you Irish boys, and returning him safely in one piece. Now I can't wait for Wednesday and my visit to the magician's lair in Leicester for him to fettle my LP12, and fix it up with a s/h Lingo ("Boo, hiss", cry some, "oh no he mustn't" - sounds just like the panto), which is what I can run to right now.

To keep up the theme, I wonder if I should capture the surgery on film (ok pixels), and doubly make sure Bruin, my o.a.p. bear, has a suitably prominent role?!

All the best for a happy listening w/e. (From tomorrow I'm home demming a pair of Allaes for a week, just to see how they compare with my beloved D15s...)

James

Good luck next week James, with the laying of hands upon your LP12. We'll both have a new ps next week.

And don't forget to report back on here.

Regards

Mark

quote:

Originally posted by JWM:
To keep up the theme, I wonder if I should capture the surgery on film (ok pixels), and doubly make sure Bruin, my o.a.p. bear, has a suitably prominent role?!
James

Well one thing is for certain ........ he'll be far more photogenic than I!

Kind regards,


Peter