Graham,

Thanks for the info.

A quick google reveals this from the gramophone forum (which I didn't even know existed):

quote:

Wait until the 1955 live stereo Ring is issued on Testament. Keilberth conducts and the singers include Astrid Varnay, Wolgang Windgassen and Hans Hotter. This Ring was recorded by Decca and should be quite something. The Solti is horribly upbeat and overdriven, with little sense of long overarchign phrasing. The brass blow far too hard for Solti too adding to the aggressive feel of the recording. Whilst we wait for the Keilberth why not try the 1951 live Bayreuth Gotterdammerung conducted by Knappertsbusch, the final scenes of Gotterdammerung on a single midprice Chandos CD conducted by Goodall or Furtwangler's RAI 1953 Ring. Barenboim's Rhengold is also a good buy. This weekend I've just found a 1951 live Walkure from Geneva which has quite blown me away. Sound is extremely full with the orchestra much better caught than the priate Bayreuth broadcasts of the era. A conductor I've never heard of - Denzler - conducts with drama and insight and the singers include Werth, Ralf, Alsen, Grob-Prandl & Hofmann. Kind regards, David Harbin Nottingham, UK

Personally, from reading the gramophone article, I'm not too keen to hear the Furtwangler. I think my next purchase will most likely be the Goodall Ring (I'd quite like to have one in English - heretical though it might be!).



regards,

Tam

quote:

Originally posted by Tam

[...]

Personally, from reading the gramophone article, I'm not too keen to hear the Furtwangler. I think my next purchase will most likely be the Goodall Ring (I'd quite like to have one in English - heretical though it might be!).



regards,

Tam

Be sure to realise that Goodall IS very slow. He makes the efforts of Klemperer, in the last years of his career, sound positively spritely. If you Want wagner's [un]heavenly lengths 30 per cent longer than anyone else Goodall is your man, and he has the singular advantage of being in English, which makes the plot that much more obvious, which may or may not be a good thing...

Fredrik

Fredrik,

Thanks for the heads up. Won't be anytime soon anyway. I thought it might be on the long side when I noticed Rheingold was on 3 discs not the more usual two.

It's a shame nobody recorded the Mackerras ring when he revived the Goodall production during his tenure at ENO.



regards,

Tam

Narya,Nenya or Vilya ?

So, I've been away for the last few days and have had to listen to Clemens Krauss conducting the "Ring" over my CD Walkman and headphones. Only managed Rheingold and Walkuere so far, but they've been quite wonderful.

They sure as heck don't have Solti's heft, but the singing is marvellous and the orchestra (from what we can hear) is quite amazing!

Graham

Graham,

Quite agree. Once I got used to the totally different sound (to solti), I have been totally hooked. If anything, I think the set had just got better and better. The Siegfried (which can drag something terrible) was wonderful last night.

I love what solti does with the ring, but in some respects, I think it's more 'solti' and slightly less operatic, if that makes any kind of sense.


regards,

Tam

I never did finish my thoughts on the Krauss Ring. I've listened to it all the way through several times now, and have to agree with Alan Blyth (Gramophone, July 2004) that this is quite wonderful.

Great cast, great orchestra, superbly conducted and in remarkably good live sound from Bayreuth - presumably radio tapes from the time (1953).

Highly recommended.

Next up, probably Furtwaengler (as mentioned above) or the still unreleased Decca/Testament stereo Keilberth Bayreuth 1955 production.

Graham

The original Japanese version

I agree with Graham. This is a ring that should be in every Wagner's collection. I'm still not sure I'd choose it over Solti (if I had to have just one) and the rest of the Boehm ring is still sitting on my 'to be listened to' shelf.

The sound is often remarkably good (sometimes giving an illusion of stereo), and the singing is of a very high standard.

I'd say Siegfried is the highlight of this cycle and I found Gotterdammerung a little sluggish and disappointing.

Personally my next ring on CD is probably still going to be Goodall (as I suggested above). I'm tempted by a Furtwangler, but we seem to have a poor choice available: the cut la scala or the inferior cast.

I also have a hankering for the Boulez ring on DVD (just because I want to find out what made it so controversial) and I'm interesting to see what reviews Barenboim's effort gets as it is released (since the review of every other dvd ring in Gramophone has gone along the lines of: will have to do until Barenboim is rereleased).


regards,

Tam

Well, having just finished the Bohm ring and watched some more of the Levine ring of DVD I though I'd bring this thread out of retirement.

To Levine and the met first. While I didn't think Rheingold was half bad, I was utter board to tears by Walkure. I don't think I'd mind the sluggish pace of the music quite so much if the singing had been better but Hildegard Behrens is pretty inadequate as Brunhilde. To make matters worse, the blocking of the action is pretty unremittingly dull (which is a shame, because when done well, as in Scottish Opera's recent ring, this can make a huge difference). Good acting could also make up for a sluggish tempo, sadly with the possible exception of James Morris as Wotan, there is none of this on offer. Indeed, Behrens is so comically bad that I was in hysterics as Wotan put her into an enchanted sleep. And I thought the met was meant to be one of the world's top opera houses, this is an embarrassment. It wasn't all awful, the magic fire effect at the end was pretty impressive and at least Leving took the ride of the valkeries at a decent lick (something he failed to do quite dramatically when they relayed a more recent cycle on R3 a two years ago). I'll carry on with Siegfried and Gotterdammerung (and, as I said, Rheingold wasn't half as bad), but if things don't improve I think I shall be getting rid of this set. It also shakes my trust in the penguin guide, I cannot understand how this part of the cycle possibly can deserve a 3 star (maximum) review, when there are so many flaws. Granted issues such as tempo may be down to personal taste, but bad acting is bad acting.

I am more positive about the Bohm ring. Of the two others to compare it against that I own on disc, I suppose the more direct competitor is the Krauss cycle (since Solti's studio recording offers an entirely different approach). Well, over Krauss, Bohm gives us stereo sound, but oddly, this does not seem to count for as much as I expected it would and, oddly, the set has disappointed in terms of audio quality at times, when I was never bothered by the issues on the Krauss set. The highlights of Krauss are unchallenged by Bohm (especially the former's superb Siegfried), indeed, Bohm's songbird is deeply disappointing (Erika Koth) and Theo Adam is no Hans Hotter. That said, Nilsson does (particularly in Gotterdammerung) have the edge of Varney. Indeed, I think I prefer the final opera on Bohm's set to Krauss. That said, if I could only keep one of these two cycles in my collection I wouldn't hesitate to keep Krauss: his sound is remarkably good, his singers are, on the whole better and I think I find his interpretations more successful. To some extent, I find that Bohm is slightly caught between two stools: on the one hand he has nothing like the orchestral quality of the studio interpretations of the likes of Solti, on the other hand, I don't think his interpretation has the brilliance of Krauss.

Before writing this, I glanced back at Alan Blyth's gramophone reviews, and see how he waxes lyrical about how you feel like you're in Bayreuth with Bohm. I have to say, I didn't feel that way, more so given that in the middle of track 8 of the last disc (the start of the final scene) two different performances have very audibly been spliced together, which hardly fits with his, live, you're there, motif. Also, for reasons passing understanding the overture to the last act of Gotterdammerung is stuck on the end of disc 3 when I would clearly have fitted onto disc 4 with the rest of act 3. It's a small thing, but damned annoying.

So, if Krauss beats hotter, what about Solti. Well, I think I need to relisten to that again. I'm also wondering if my idea of picking up Goodall next is a good one (given he isn't the quickest on the block). Can anyone comment on the kind of speeds Furtwangler takes in his interpretations?


regards, Tam

Ah A real Wagner Thread! Sorry, but I could not resist that dear Tam! And you know how fond of of Wagner, I am (NOT)!

All the best from Fredrik

PS, Just off to see how old Schubert is doing!!

I suppose that's what I get for hijacking the schubert thread to talk about Wagner?

Hehe! Fredrik

Well, from what I've read on the Testament website, their Ring will beat all comers.

Graham

The new Gramophone reviews Siegfried, though, sadly, there was no sample on the CD That said, Alan Blyth still manages to rave about it:

"...you have a cast to dream about. Don't take my word for it: buy the discs and experience Wagner as he was supremely performed in those special days, and thank your lucky stars someone has had the persistence to unearth the recording."

It's due out tomorrow, so hopefully I'll be able to pick it up

regards, Tam

Tam

Well, I'm a sad bastard, so I'll await the reviews. And will Testament release the whole iot in a box after the fuss has died down?

Graham

I don't know. Testament don't seem to go in for box sets though.... they seem to operate pretty much a blanket policy of £10.99 per disc and that's it. Still, I don't really have the patience to wait for them to do that, if at all.

Also, for those who are interested, it's also being released on vinyl.

regards, Tam

Well, I've just picked it up and started playing. Yours for £43.99 (or less if you shop around online). Packaged beautifully, and, unusually for Testament it's in one of those cardboard boxes with the cds in slip-cases, each one bearing a photo of one of the cast.

The full libretto is included along with some very detailed notes.

But enough of all that, how does it sound? Very good. This is by far and away the best sound I've heard from a 50s Bayreuth recording (as you would well expect and it makes the likes of Krauss in 53 or Knappertsbusch in '56 sound horribly tinny in comparison). Indeed, the sound is probably comparable with Bohm in 67, though the singing is finer. I haven't yet listened to enough of it to compare the overall performance to either Krauss or Solti. However, the sound is not perfect, the strings do not sound quite right to my ears, especially in comparison with Solti (though this may be a function of the Bayreuth house and the way Wagner wanted it). The other issue is that there is sometimes a lot of sibilance on the voices and this is a great shame. However, those minor reservations aside, first impression: fantastic.

regards, Tam

Tam

As you said earlier, Alan Blyth seems hugely impressed.

A strange decision on Testament's part to release Siegfried first, though. I wonder why?

Graham

Well, I've only listened to the first act, and a few other bits, but so far I'm very impressed, especially when I put a little bit of the Krauss ring on for comparison, the sound is in another league. The first scene is not, musically, so good as Krauss, but come scene 2 things really get going. I'll reserve my judgement until I've listened to the rest.

As to the order, I don't really understand it either. Perhaps it wasn't all the same team and that was ready first, perhaps they are expecting sales of Siegfried to be the slowest and this way it builds the momentum better... it's a shame they don't tell us why though.

regards, Tam